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Welcome to the Growth Mindset Show. This is another episode this Friday
My name is Mahesh Dhan, founder of C-Shop Corner and host of this Growth Mindset Show
If you are joining us for the first time, welcome to the show
If you are joining us back, welcome back to the show. As some of you may already know, this show is every Friday at 12 noon Eastern Time
First things first, today here outside of Florence here, it's nice, sunny, 95 degrees, one of the hottest days
So if I'm sweating here, it's just hot outside here and inside as well
Today we actually have a very exciting agenda. We have a special guest, Magnus Martenssen
I know some of you may already know Magnus, good friend. And I believe Simon is going to play a little video after that on the intro
We are going to have Magnus, he's going to talk about cloud, career, job, growth, community
and anything else you want to ask Magnus. Traveling, food, whatever you want to talk about
Again, as some of you may know, if you are joining us back, you already know that, what we do on the show
But if somebody is joining us for the first time on this show, we cover anything and everything what you have on your mind
If you have any questions about anything, we just talk here, okay
You can ask any questions here. Our focus is mostly on growth mindset
If you're not familiar with growth mindset, check out some of our early videos, the first episodes
where we just talk about growth mindset, what it is, and so on and so forth
Here in the U.S. and a bunch of parts of the world, it's still summer, it's still going on, people are still on vacation
So for the next couple of more weeks, during the whole of this month, we're going to keep this agenda light
But after the session, we are going to pick up, and again, that will be focused on certain topics
such as building better software, consulting, you know, how to become a consultant
We're going to focus more on specific topics. But until then, we're just going to keep it light
I hope everybody's still here. In some part, it's growing. Hopefully, you are in your family state
Just stay safe. That's all I can do. All I can do is more like a reminder to even myself
And then we have Agile Summit on the back, and during the show, we'll talk a little bit about Agile Summit and upcoming conferences as well
So with that, well, let's bring Magnus back in the studio here. Magnus
Hey, Magnus
Welcome to the show. Hello, Mahesh. Good to see you. Long time no see
How's everything? It is surprisingly good. Honestly, if boredom is the biggest problem you have during this pandemic, then you're still pretty well off
And by that, I mean that it's monotonous to work from home, not travel, not being able to go to India
not being able to travel and meet my presentation friends around the world, right
I have some of my best friends in this industry, and I haven't seen them for, you know, two years or something, right
But it is surprisingly well. I get to do a lot of work from home
Well, that's great. That's great. I think, first things first, congratulations on your new job and new role
How's that going? It's going well. I decided to join a company called Plano, and I am the chief product officer for that company
which effectively means, in this case, that I am in charge of the strategy and the development of the product expectation of our offering
so that we will be able to sell the same offering to many customers, right
And, of course, have them benefit from each other's experiences. So I'm a product officer
That's awesome. That's awesome. Yeah, that's a great title. So basically, you know, you are not only responsible for building the product features, but also I'm sure you're involved in giving your team feedback from audience
from the developers. So tell me more about this product, what the product and offering is, if you don't mind
No, I don't mind. Yeah, yeah. I can give you the highlights. Effectively, we are a company that consults around a very big model around Azure for our customers
And then Azure is a dear topic of mine, of course, since many, many years
And what we see in the industry generally speaking is that there is a huge deficit
There is a lack of experienced Azure computer engineers. And we have some solutions that we feel are useful for our customers, obviously, that help them with governance and compliance and operations and all kinds of things that are difficult to do
Monitoring, for example, all kinds of things, right? And so what we are doing is we're taking care to create our solutions in such a way that we can repeat them effectively with multiple customers
Multiple benefits there, of course. The customers share the cost of this, which means that it should be cost effective
And additionally, if one customer has a requirement or a problem or an issue, we bring that in and we solve it
And then we can distribute that solution to all customers. So we just feel that a productization of offering is kind of logical
That's great. So is your company also have customers in the U.S. or is it more focused on Europe
Currently, this company has European customers in the Nordics mostly. That is definitely in growth, subject to change continuously
But, yeah, the great thing is that a company can have a lot of really skilled, seasoned engineers that are really good at what they do
So no problem there. And it becomes a little bit delicate when you deal with these people because they are so good at what they do
You know, they can be great architects and software architects and all kinds of people
And then when they start using a platform like Azure, they still don't know the secret, you know, the secret sauce, the tips and tricks and how to make it run efficiently and optimized and cost efficient and secure and compliant and all the things, right
And that's where we can help. That's what we do. Okay, great. Great
All right. So everybody, welcome to the show. I see that Leger joined us from Senegal
Arjun, Arvind, who else is here? I see some familiar faces, guys
Welcome to the show. As some of you may already know, you can ask any of your questions here
You start posting your questions in the second half of the show, and I'm done with my questions
You can start asking your questions. So, Magnus, you're going to cover a few things today
Obviously, one of the biggest topics is Azure and the cloud in general
And a lot of our audience, they are trying to either get in the cloud or they're already in the cloud and all that
So that will be one topic I want to cover. And then I also want to cover some part of the community, you know
And one thing before that I want to really ask you this personal question is that you moved from – you were running your own consulting company before, right? Yes
And then now you have moved to become an employee. So what kind of that transition look like
And if somebody's watching and they want to say, you know what, I've been running my own consulting company, what is your view on that side
Yeah, that is a great question because that caught me entirely by surprise
Yeah, and you can also say, you know, when you started a little bit background, what made you start your own company, right
Yeah, so I started my own company because I felt that I wanted to have kind of executive freedom for myself to decide how I wanted to do things. Yeah
For a person like me. Yeah, for a person like myself, I have experience
I know the score. I ran my own company for, what was it, six, seven years
It's still six, right? Eight years or something. And I made money all the time
Like from day one, I always made money. So that wasn't an issue at all
And with that, I can be employed at any company. The thing was that I also wanted my freedom to be able to travel to these conferences and speak and share in other ways, right
Maybe decide to deliver a workshop somewhere for someone, right? So I do that as well
I like that change of pace. That's why I decided to start my own company
So I could decide when I wanted to work with a customer and deliver customer work, you know, hours and send out invoices, right
And when I wanted to maybe travel and deliver some training somewhere in the world
I can deliver training on five continents, right? So really, I wanted to have that freedom
And that's why I started my own company, Lossy Socks. Yeah. And then, yeah, one thing people also don't realize
You know, a lot of people ask me all the time, I want to start my own company. Well, that's great
I mean, listen, I always encourage people to start their own company because it gives you freedom, flexibility and all that
But it comes with a lot of challenges, right? Especially during the pandemic, like you have to promote yourself, brand yourself, market yourself and sell your services, right
Why people should be asking, calling you to help them or companies mostly, not even people, it's mostly companies
And then there's no guarantee that after this contract, you know, I will get to do something forever like you
And three months later, if your contract is done, there's no guarantee you're going to have another contract
So you have to always constantly keep looking for new projects. That's exactly right
It is challenging. It is. You kind of, my biggest experience for running my own company is like just a couple of things, right
But the biggest thing is that you need to be on your game all the time, constantly kind of on your toes
It is quite much easier to be an engineer and get an assignment to you and work on that assignment and deliver the outcome
And then maybe at some point, get another assignment and go on to deliver that because it's someone else's job to ensure that there's a pipeline of incoming assignments, right
If you run your own company, obviously, that is you. If you are employed, there's a sales team that takes care of that
So there is, you need to be a little bit more on your game all the time, on your toes
You need to enjoy that. If you don't like doing all kinds of things like that, then if your passion is to do only, only, only technology, then maybe consider just being employed because it's going to be easier
Yeah. So in brief, if you want to start your own company, you have to be your own salesperson, your marketing person, your technical developer, and also your accounting and finance, everything you have to do yourself
Head of purchase is one thing that I manage to outsource them because the head of purchase for my company is my wife
So, you know. Yeah. Yeah. There you go. I'm doing that. No problem. Yeah
I'm doing that. And, you know, in my experience, I'm sure you have been the same
Sometimes, you know, clients, you may not get paid on time. Do you also have the other enforcers
Oh, yeah. Yeah. It is all of that. I've actually had a great portion of having wonderful customers all the time that, you know, pay their bills on time and everything
So maybe I'm lucky. I don't know. But that's how it works out well for me
Yeah. But with my experience, I've seen, especially if you're working for a general company, a startup, sometimes they just don't have money to pay, right? True. True
And that was actually the other thing, Mahesh, that I wanted to mention. I think there were a couple of things that come to mind when it's about starting your own company
And it's people told me this. I was kind of prepared. Maybe I didn't fully believe them
But they said, like, it takes two years before you're really on the field, right, before you really have everything right
Before you really have everything running and it works. And I have to say, about a year, year and a half in, I had a bit of a gift, you know, that I came out of one assignment and there wasn't immediately some other work for me to do, especially after summer, right
It's quite difficult for, if you're a small company like mine, to ensure that you get going after the summer holidays and have a new assignment ready and you can get going with that and you can start up and so on
And, I mean, I didn't, after that summer, I didn't make money until, fortunately I had some money in the account of the company, right
But I had to, like, be very careful about how much salary I took out from the company during that little space, little time, right
I continued to take out a salary, but it felt like I was draining my account
And I was not ready to quit, but I was beginning to, a little bit doubt, right, is this actually going to carry
And it wasn't until September that I had some work to do and that meant that I spent all of my invoice in October and I didn't get paid until November
And, I mean, that's just painful. But I got through it, right
And I spoke with my accountant and she said that this is the, like, you need to make your own decision here
This is what happened. This is when a startup company, when they quit, right
This is when they give up and say, okay, it didn't work, damn it, right
But I got through it and it's been better and better year over year ever since
Well, that's great. Yeah, I agree with that. And one more thing, before we move to a different topic, is that if you run your own company, there's no vacation
There's no paid vacation. What do you mean vacation? So, if you are taking a vacation and you're not working, nobody's going to pay you
Nobody's going to pay you. Yeah. Somebody, you know, if you are trying to start your own company, these are some of the things you have to keep in mind before you jump full time
So, that's great. That's great. So, let's move to our next topic
So, there is a big IGO conference coming up. IGO is a huge platform
I'm partnering with several organizations there. It's going to be one of the biggest
I just saw today, this morning, just on LinkedIn, we have 31,000 registrations just on LinkedIn. Jesus. 31,000
And these are the registered people. They are registered on LinkedIn. And luckily, my friend, my good friend, who works with me as a co-worker, he runs a LinkedIn product now
And he's like, what the hell is that doing? You're going to trash our server? We didn't design LinkedIn for this big event
We have our backroom helper, Simon, who says over 40,000. Oh, wow. Yeah
And then you have registrations on C-Shop Corner. You have registrations on Agile website
That's the registration. So, let's say even we reach 60,000 registrations, it's going to live stream probably 250,000 people because then it's going to live stream on C-Shop Corner and other platforms as well
So, no pressure on my team, I guess. Yeah, no pressure at all. No pressure at all
But thank you to every whole team behind the scenes working with me for several months now, promoting and marketing
So, thank you so much. So, you are the keynote speaker at the summit
You wanted to talk about that. And maybe Simon, you can share the website URL here
I'm sure he will. I can't say all day. Do you want to give a little bit preview of what the keynote is going to be all about, why people should join
Oh, yeah. Well, I'm not completely done with my keynote yet. It's still a month out, right
So, I'm still okay. However, I can disclose that I will be talking
I will be giving a little bit of a state of the union briefly about what I see happening, the larger trends with Azure and cloud right now in terms of in those areas that I work daily
helping my customers, handling the larger challenges of operations and compliance and security, things that whenever we come to a new customer, at any time we come to a new customer
the issue is that there are multiple things that they do badly, right
All customers do badly. Monitoring, governance, operations, these kinds of things. And these are areas if you want to know where to get the next job, what to focus on in your career
These are definitely topics that you want to listen to during my keynote and maybe try to find a path to one of those job opportunities because, as I was explaining before, there is a shortage of experienced people
So, if you can make an investment for yourself or for your company, for your employees, maybe even if you have many in those areas, you'll definitely have a lot of business going forward
So, that was my next question. People who are watching this show, if they had to choose a career, next career, what they should be learning next, do you think the cloud and Azure is the way to go
Where do you think they can go and learn? Well, I mean, we can share some resources about that with the show links for this
There are multiple learning tracks and other things, other resources that you can get from companies like Microsoft and other training vendors
And getting certified is certainly another thing that you can focus on
Of course, right? So, certifications kind of start this, something called Microsoft Learn, where you can go and look at the various areas where you can get certified
And certification is certainly one good way to learn a lot of things or maybe a little of a lot of things, right
So, you kind of know the lay of the land in a certain area. And then you, of course, need to start working in that area to find your specialties and what you focus on the most, right
But yeah, I mean, there's kind of general terms there. But still, I would definitely invest, if you're an engineer, right, and you want to have an exciting job future, I would definitely invest in cloud skills
It doesn't have to be Azure cloud. I happen to spend my time on the Azure cloud
It could be either of the clouds or any of the clouds. Do whatever you like
What makes you happy? Azure cloud is certainly a really good investment
Yeah, all cloud, you're right. All clouds are growing, right? AWS, everything
Yeah, all of them are growing. Everything. Even Alibaba. Everything is growing
Numbers, I heard a couple of years ago, so they may have, you know, they've changed a little bit, right
But a couple of years ago, I heard some numbers that said, okay, so now we have all of this cloud
Everything is cloud, cloud, cloud, cloud, cloud. You hear only cloud when you talk to people, right
How big a portion of the total compute power in the world is actually executed in the cloud
So out of all servers, right, you know, self-hosted, hosted at a company, co-location, all other things that are not the cloud vendors
Yeah, it was something like, you know, it was 15% or something that was the cloud market
And the rest, all of the other servers, all of the other compute farms and things were not cloud
And so you can imagine the growth potential there is completely massive, mind-blowing for all of the clouds, right
Which is why the big clouds like the big three, then, you know, you'll have your AWS, your Azure, and your Google
why they don't actually need to compete with each other. There is so much market for them to take
But why should they compete for each other's little piece of the market, right? That's crazy
So it's really exciting, just cloud in general. Yeah, they can't keep up with their own growth, right, because the demand is so much
And they just like, even like, they have more and more customers joining their behind
So you're right. They don't need to compete because. And other big things also, you know, more and more clients we work with now
this was not three years ago, but during this pandemic, what has happened is that even all the developer resources
like developer machines are also migrating to cloud now. So companies are saying, hey, you don't need laptops anymore
All you have to do is log into our cloud in AWS or Azure, and we have your machine set up there. Yes
So this trend is going to continue to grow, right? It is, for sure
And I would say, so I'm in, you know, I wouldn't say that I'm in the middle of my career
It depends on how much I want to work in life. We'll see. I mean, I don't mind getting rich and retiring at some point
We'll see about that. I'm still working on it. But I'm certainly, you know, a good number of years into my career
And looking at what is a reasonable remainder of my work life, right
I comfortably can say that I can work with cloud for the rest of my career
and it's probably going to be bigger than ever at the point in the future somewhere where I decide to retire
So I would say it's a good future investment for someone who is maybe a young engineer
or maybe haven't worked with cloud that wants to do something exciting is to consider a career in the cloud
Yeah, I don't think you and I will ever retire. We'll always be speaking and traveling
I couldn't give a timeframe. I was like, when is this going to happen
I don't even know. It's just you won't get paid for it. That's all
We'll see. Hopefully, we'll be rich and just be able to lounge back and do what we like, right
That's what I'm hoping. Yeah. Yeah. Hey, welcome, Vishal. Nice to see Vishal for a long time, after a long time
Hopefully, everything is going well with you. People are joining us again
Welcome to the show. Again, this show is for you. I'll keep repeating this
This show is not for me. This is not for me. We are here just to share our experience and thoughts and what we learned from our mistakes
But, again, this show is for you. So if you have any kind of questions, you know, it can be related to your personal, professional growth, job, career, community, anything
If you have any questions, just ask because the more questions you ask, the better it is for you
Because, you know, then you know at least you are not sleeping there. So you are listening
Yeah, and anything we can do to help, right? So that's great
I agree with Magnus. So let's move to our next topic. And after that, we will take a two-minute break, and then we will come back after that
So, you know, you travel for conferences to, you know, India and other countries
And we keep planning this, and then pandemic keeps happening, and, you know, we're still unsure
How are things there in your freedom and other, you know, in those Nordic countries
What do you see anything changing in, like, coming to, you know, a few months or a year
Yeah, that's a great question. I've tried to, or we, I should say, we have a little, just a tiny community conference that we have run year over year
And to share knowledge with our local community in Sweden. We have a little tiny community conference called South Bird
And Alan Smith and myself are hosting that or arranging that conference
And we get the opportunity to invite some of our good friends and teachers from the community, experts who come to Sweden and share
We tried to set this conference up now for after summer, September time frame
And it failed because people were reluctant to travel still, and they couldn't really see going, you know, traveling to a physical conference
And also audience-wise would be the same, right? Who can come actually and attend the conference during this time
So we tried, and the outcome was not yet. We can't have physical conferences yet
That is sort of the result of that. We're seeing a little bit of uptake now in the pandemic numbers
You know, new sick cases in Europe and in Sweden as well
After summer, people have been trying to go to holiday and they go somewhere and they maybe hang out more socially
And the virus spreads a little bit more. But we are doing very well in terms of vaccination and so forth
So I don't know. I think physical conferences are probably definitely out for this year
I hear that there are a few physical attendee conferences happening. But larger conferences for sure will not happen yet for a while. Yeah
So, yeah, same thing. We are in the boat. We were planning to do something in India
But let's see what happens. You know, what happens after this, you know, I would say afterwards
Things look better. We will try to do something. Yeah. So everybody, again, we're going to take a two-minute break right now
We are at 1230. I see some couple of questions in the air
Neil, thank you for asking questions. Everybody, feel free to ask, post your questions
In the second half, we're going to take your questions. And, Neil, I want to ask you a few things which was not on the agenda
Mostly around – so one of our topics in the Growth Mindset is build better software
So we want to focus not just learning how to build software, but how do you build better software, right
And if you become a senior, if you are like a, you know, five-plus years experience, seven, eight, ten years experience
you are a lead, you are an architect, your focus should not just be the building quicker, faster
That's great. But your focus should be that it is really better
Is it future-proof? Is it like sustainable? Is it scalable? Is it all reliable and so on and so forth
So when we come back, I'm going to pick your brain on that if you are helping this company
First of all, how are you guys do that? And do you – just say to your audience, our developers, software developers, how do you get their feedback
How do you make your software better in different ways? Anything, you know, we'd love to get your, you know, thoughts on that side
And everybody who has joined us today, thank you so much for hanging out on Friday
We will be back in two minutes. COVID makes us feel like this and work from home like this
But what if work looks like this? With a leader like this and a payday that feels like this
Learn how to change your mind and your mindset with the Growth Mindset Kit every Friday at 10 a.m. ET
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Hey guys, can't believe we haven't seen each other since graduation in May. What's going on
Not much, with the pandemic, I can't really do anything right now
Me too, I'm meant to just stay home, hang out with my dog, and watch the news
I feel you. Have you guys been able to get jobs yet
Some of it, yeah. Jerry and I have actually been working on something together
Yeah, we came up with an idea for a startup that's an app that will help us stay active since we both have been sitting around so much during this quarantine
That's genius. I could definitely use something like that. When are you guys launching it
No, that's the issue. We don't really know how to build it, so we're kind of stuck
I know of this company that they started advising if you guys are interested
Oh really? Yeah, they're called Minecracker, and they'll help you validate your idea, and connect you with angel investors
and help you build everything from your polished MVP to your technical team, and even your go-to-market planning and execution
That's awesome. Do you know how you can get in touch with them? Yeah, you can just visit their website, minecracker.us
That's awesome, Max. Thanks. I'm excited to get started on that. Of course. Good luck, guys, and let's talk soon
Thanks, Max. And we're back. All right, we're back, and somehow on my computer I don't see my... something is going on here
Let's see. Anyway, I'll go blind, I guess. I'm behind the scenes. My computer is not refreshing it
So maybe I should come back in a minute? Let me try to log in again, guys. Okay
I'll be back here. I'll be back. I'll see you soon. All right
All right. Okay, so we are back here. Now I can see you
So, Neo, we have a question on Facebook. Neo asked... Neo is... It's a long name
I think he's a billionaire, as it states here. That's great. Good to have him. That's great
So Neo says, what learning path can I take to ensure that I master all, I guess, objects or programming
You want to take that, sir? I don't even know. I do not even know, honestly
That is a great question, and I cannot answer it all. Do you have any ideas
Yeah, I can jump on it. So object oriented programming is one of the ways you can write programs
It's not something you need really a learning path for it. For example, if you take any book, say C Sharp programming book, on C Sharp, we have three books
where if you search, you know, OOP and C Sharp, you will see an article
Object-oriented programming is simple. There's four or five different features. It's programming language support
That's, you know, encapsulation, inheritance, stress, blah, blah, polymorphism. If any programming language supports that, that's object-oriented programming
And, for example, C Sharp language, C++ has all those. So this is a very small part of programming
You don't need a path for that, really. And you have to know how to apply that in your, you know, your daily programming life
And you don't really need sometimes when you're building a website. You don't even care about some of these features that are already part of it
When you're creating a class, you're already using it. When you are, you know, enhancing the other class from one class, you're already using OOP
It becomes just part of your daily practice. You don't need to worry about that
You have to know the fundamentals, yes. But your path could be more like how do I become a, you know, web developer, you know, all those things
So, that's kind of all I would say. Thank you for the question, though
Anybody else, just please post your questions. You can take any questions
Just ask your questions. All right. So, Magnus, we talked about the community
We talked about the conferences. We talked about the travel. We talked about your job
Let's talk about another my favorite topic. Let's talk to it. You know, this is before you joined this company
You were working with your clients and all that. So, I'm sure you were working with some team of developers, right
Of course. The Linux software. I'm the tech leader as well. Not only the CTO, but I'm also the tech leader for the largest customer that our company has
Perfect, perfect. So, yeah, when you are thinking of building better software, what are the things you keep in mind
And if you have some aspiring tech leads and architects watching this, what do you do if you are in, you know, some fifth and sixth one
What would you like to share with us? Yeah, that is a big topic, of course
You can go low level and learn how to write secure code and so forth, right
That's, you know, always good. Ensure that you have good coding standards, coding practices, and you write your code
It's built by design and so on. Absolutely. Another kind of more high level thing that I have to practice all the time is that our team, as the customer that we have, is the cloud center of excellence, if you will
And this cloud center of excellence can be either perceived negatively or, and this you have to work a lot on, can be perceived in a positive light, right
So either it can be that we go out and tell everyone else in the other teams, here is what you need to do to make things better and do the right thing
But then it comes off as us trying to boss them around or maybe being like Edward Tower Architects that comes out and bestows wisdom on them
And that's maybe not always perceived so well. If you want to write better software, you need to collaborate with the people that can, you know, will be using the software
Other teams, if you're, we're the central hub for a lot of code, and we distribute that to other teams
And whenever they have an opinion about our code, you know, maybe a change or something, in our case we're open for a full request, of course, then
That someone else in the company, the large enterprise, can take a look at our code, suggest a fix or a change, and come with their input to us
So I would say delegate, maybe, is the larger word that we use here, but ensure maybe to be open and inclusive to other people influencing the software, within reason, of course
Always within reason, but you can't possibly think of every scenario. And people will take your code and use it in a way that you never even envisioned at all
And the best thing that can happen is that they come back and tell you the story of how they used your code or how they failed using it, potentially
And maybe bring you back something like the full request. Just give you a piece of their mind in return
If you can nurture and foster that kind of behavior and just be friendly and take in other people's input, you will be able to add value from completely other people, right, to your code
Things that you never thought of. Use cases that you never thought of
Can help you expand and build better software. Yep. And that's great
So definitely secure code is very important, and developers sometimes don't pay attention in the beginning
They will only just write code, write code, and show the process, like, how much work they have done. Right
And that's where, I don't know, you see all the hacks happening all the time because you're behind and you never go back
You think you'll come back. Oh, I'm going to come back later. I'm going to come back
Yeah, yeah. You know the quote from Pirates of the Caribbean, right
You are without a doubt the worst pirate that I have ever heard of
But you have to admit it. It's kind of the same thing, right
This is the worst code that I've ever seen running in my life. But it's there. Running
Yeah, and then what happens is, you know, you get hacked, and then everybody panics. Yep
That's great. Yeah, I think a couple of days ago there was a $600 million, you know, crypto was stolen from hacking
It's all because people are rushing to write the code and nobody is paying attention to code security. Yeah
And this happens all the time. Think about it. Yeah. And then, oh, by the way, we have Code Quad is another big topic, which is, I think, if you are a senior developer or lead
you definitely need to start paying too much attention to it because that's where, you know
company, anybody expects you to, you know, focus on as well. So David has a show on every Saturday in here on T-Shop Corner
He just focuses on code quality and performance. So check out his show
That's all he talks about. And he has a book on it, standards and quality and all that. Yep
Cool guy. Yep. He's definitely a great guy. He definitely loves his shows and his guitar, like say rock star personality in the code. Yeah
I had the privilege of traveling with David to Mauritius and India and other places. Yeah
So one other thing I want to talk about in building a better software is that the user side. Yep
Our end user, so you call them customers or members. It doesn't matter what you call
These are the people who actually end up using the software you build. Yep
So what's your take on that? Like, you know, do you involve them while you're building it
Do you want to share something around those? It's kind of along the same lines currently for me there where we have, you know
the advantages that we work with other engineers that will take our pieces of code and our guidance
and our help hopefully if they are willing to take it and build their own solutions using the guidance
and the parts that we supply, the component library that we have, you know
So our customers, our engineers are not necessarily end users, but there's a lot to be said
regardless of your scenario, for being, I don't know, delicate enough or maybe, you know
you have to be able to listen and maybe take in the suggestions that come from your users
and maybe politely not say no, but maybe say thank you for the input and we will, you know, consider this
But that actually means no. But it is a delicate scenario to respect your user, your customer
And I see a lot of outcomes where the user hasn't been involved when the software was built
or the people who built it never listened to the users and the users become frustrated and angry and feel like they are not heard or respected
And it is, I mean, there are so many human elements to building software, it's incredible
Actually sitting down and typing code words on the keyboard is the smallest piece of what we do
And making sure that you build the right thing, that your audience is happy
that the users, whatever you call them, are glad to use your software, those are the larger part of what we do
Yeah. Okay, great. So that's good to know that your audience are technical people
So if all these people watching this show are technical, right, can they go and try out your software or is it something they have to deal with your company
and sign up some kind of agreement and all that? How does that work
They would be interested in using the cloud quickly and accurately, right
So you can either spend all the time you have, you know, or spend a lot of time at least
understanding what is optimal, compliant and secure in the cloud. Or you can take a proven library that is already there and start using those building blocks to build your own solutions
and ensuring then by design that you are compliant. So you would be a company building software or a large organization maybe and enterprise
Technically it would work for a smaller company as well to use our components
I'm not sure that I see that it is feasible to buy our catalog of components if you are a smaller company
but anything is possible. So that would be the target audience for what we are doing
Okay, so I'm definitely going to check it out because we may be a small company but we have a large supply
There you go. If you like some components, you can go to our large enterprises, come to us and say
hey, rather than directly go by ourselves, what about we just take this component from here
and obviously they said I have to buy the license and all that
But I'm definitely interested in learning to see what your company has to offer
Maybe you can have some calls from your team to get this out. That would be cool
Okay, cool. Well, we are almost at the tail end of this show
A couple of things we're going to close early, maybe two more, three more minutes
So what's your plan now? So we're done with all this. Summer is almost over
What's your plan this summer when you're going back to full speed at work
And then anything fun you have planned? I'm back full speed at work already, actually
My summer holiday was not that long. But it's still a little summery and kind of warm here in Sweden, so that's nice
My plans are to go full speed ahead with work now for a while, I guess
and maybe look forward to finding some travel and holiday in the near future, I hope
I don't know. But, I mean, now it's just back to business as usual
I guess that's maybe not exciting. I actually like what I do, so I think it's pretty exciting
Well, that's great. That's great. So, listen, this is Friday. I know you're going to go for dinner and hang out with family
I won't take you much time. I'll give you 10 extra minutes from this show. Okay
So next time I'll take it more from you. Anything else you want to plug in before we close out this show
Yeah, I just want to say that I'm looking so much forward to the upcoming conference
so I really think it's going to be great. For me, that's so super exciting to be able to join you, and I wish, I mean, remember, right
we were trying to make plans for the CISA Corner Conference, the annual conference in Denmark
and the pandemic hit and we had to, like, cancel everything. It was just terrible
I really, really did like that we were forced out of traveling
So, if I'm looking forward to anything, it is for people to get their blood and vaccination
so we can get the vaccine under control and then get back to somewhat of a normal life
that comes after the pandemic. Yep. So, I agree with everybody. If you're watching, please, please get your vaccination done so we can move ahead
while we're in the pandemic. With that, I think everybody, thank you so much, Simon and the team, behind the scenes
for all the hard work you do. Everybody doing a lot of social media
And thank you, everybody, for joining us. And, Magnus, thank you so much for, you know, providing all the insights and advice to people
It's absolutely my pleasure. Thank you. Thank you so much for having me
Enjoy your weekend. I'll talk to you soon. Yeah, thanks, man. Bye
Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye